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S. Michael Houdmann
Supporter
The Bible tells us that "all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be" (Psalm 139:16). So, yes, God knows exactly when, where, and how we will die. God knows...
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Dan Rivers
Supporter
I do believe what David tells us in Psalm 139:16, but I don't believe that we can die prematurely because of our own acts...nor can anyone extend their life beyond that which God has decreed...
That would mean that we can circumvent the will of God...
If he says that, Psa 139:16 NLT - {16} You saw me before I was born. Every day of my life was recorded in your book. Every moment was laid out before a single day had passed.
It clearly means that EVERY day ordained for us have been written in his book,"BEFORE A SINGLE DAY HAD PASSED"
That would mean that the day someone started to smoke cigarettes, that day would have been already written in the God's book...
I'm sure all of us know of healthy young Christians that died "prematurely" in a car accidents, in war, by criminal means...i believe that was God's will for them...To be with the Lord when he decided he wanted them to be with him.
The day someone commits suicide, that day was written in God's book before it happened...
He told Moses when he would die...Deut 32:50
And he told Abraham about his death, [Gen 15:15 NLT] 15 (As for you, you will die in peace and be buried at a ripe old age.)
Job also said it...Job 14:5 NLT - {5} You have decided the length of our lives. You know how many months we will live, and we are not given a minute longer.
[Jer 10:23 NIV] 23 LORD, I know that people's LIVES are NOT their own; it is NOT for them to direct their steps.
[Isa 25:1 NLT] 1 O LORD, I will honor and praise your name, for you are my God. You do such wonderful things! You PLANNED them long ago, and now you have accomplished them.
[Pro 16:33 NLT] 33 We may throw the dice, but the LORD determines how they fall.
[Isa 37:26 NLT] 26 "But have you not heard? I decided this long ago. Long ago I PLANNED it, and now I AM MAKING it happen...
[Deu 32:39 NIV] 39 "See now that I myself am he! There is no god besides me. I PUT TO DEATH and I BRING TO LIFE, I have wounded and I will heal, and no one can deliver out of my hand.
I'm glad he is the one that plans and makes everything happen. For if it were up to me to plan and implement my future, I would surely mess it up..
We cannot circumvent God's will even the manner and time of our death...
Billy P Eldred
Supporter
God knows when we are going to die. That does not mean, however, that that day is unchangeable. One of the best examples of the power of prayer is in the book of 2 Kings chapter 20 where God sent his prophet to tell Hezekiah that he was about to die. Hezekiah then wept and prayed to God and God added 15 years to Hezekiah' life. God is in charge. God has sent angels to save lives. JESUS has healed from fatal diseases, even raised back to life. We should never worry about when we will die. We should be ready for death at any time and for us Saved by Grace, death will be gain, but it is not up to us when we die. And if we are told that we are going to die, fervent prayer can even help us to live longer by God's Grace.
Chris Button
Supporter
Do we have an appointed time of death? God is sovereign and NOTHING happens that He hasn't caused or allowed. That being said, God knows when each of us will die but God does not necessarily choose that time for us. (It's the difference between "Chris, before the beginning of time I have decreed that you will die on Dec 24, 2015 at 11:12am CDT due to a massive heart attack." and God knowing I will die under those circumstances.) Aside from Christ returning (or the Enoch factor :-), everyone will die at some point due to disease, natural causes, murder, suicide, etc. This all stems from the Fall in Genesis 3. Because of the Fall, we are separated from God. In order to have that fellowship with God restored, He sent His Son to die in order to pay our fine that was due us for our disobedience. God gives us free will to choose or reject life (both spiritual and physical). God allows us to choose Him or our own lesser, and ultimately unfulfilling, version of Him. Those are really the only two choices in life. I can choose to drive myself crazy trying to out-think God by dwelling on whether or not God caused someone to die. I can sprain my brain wondering why someone died and if God had a higher purpose for that death. I can also choose to marvel in the fact that through God's grace, I am alive at this very moment typing these words. I can be grateful for the short time I do have on this planet and rest in the joy that only comes from trusting in the work Christ has done already done. Or not...the choice is mine.
Lynn Willis
Supporter
SUCH a GREAT discussion bringing SO many closer to the Lord! SO on the premise that God knows all, sees all, plans all and decides all, our life/fate is in His hands from the start and all this discussion about us affecting our lives with circumstances like unhealthy lifestyles and bad choices is simply irrelevant? Quite the opposite in my humble opinion because God allows U turns, and prayer, as in Hezekiah's aforementioned life circumstances changes everything. God does nothing except in response to believing prayer. We forget that our God is a merciful, grace-giving forgiving God (especially when we repent and are live obediently) and when we live for HIM and not ourselves, the relationship is in balance as it should. It is when we are apart from Him that we screw it all up, fall away, make bad choices, sin, sin, sin and are tempted and spiritually controlled by the accuser. SO I truly do believe that God already knows we will fall (and that He will fight for us and catch us), and if we will come back (like Jonah in the belly of the fish... God knew it would take 3 days for the man to snap out of it but He still gave him those 3 days in solitude to do so!) and when we will. I believe God also knew Jesus would pray 'IF'... and He also knew the hard choice He had to make to save US. Today is Valentine's Day and the one thing God has taught me over and over and over again is that Love IS a sacrifice, but also that Love Never Fails. I believe in healing prayer. I believe the Lord God Almighty will heal me as I battle this life threatening disease I am at present afflicted with. Was it my life bad choices that gave me this disease? NO! Disease is NOT from God but the evil one but I do know that God will use all for His glory and I offer it ALL up to Him accordingly. I also know He will use me in that victory over illness to bring more people to Him cos that is our one clear purpose in following Jesus on this earth: TO BE FISHERS OF MEN. Lest we forget. Halleluyah! Halleluyah! Halleluyah! Be blessed today in your God given breaths. Amen and Amen.
Andrew Rodriguez
Supporter
There are many verses in scriptures where it indicates we all have an appointed time to die. In order for it to be appointed, doesn't it also mean it has to be predestined? I believe so. Doesn't God before the foundations of the world predetermine when we die and isn't that predetermination based on his will and not on our merits? Again, I believe so. I believe whether we live to 30 or 90 has been predetermined before time, and no matter how we've lived our lives with much sinfulness or not or whether we smoked, or drank or even ate unhealthy I do not believe it changes the time frame of when you die. What I do believe is this, if you eat healthy, exercise, refrain from drinking, smoking or even drug addiction you will be healthier, you'll feel better, and you'll have less sicknesses during your lifetime as opposed to doing all those things in excess and physically feeling lousy throughout your lifetime and or having to deal with sicknesses or diseases during your life. You will still die at your appointed time but you can choose how you live it. I've seen way too many Christians who were young, vibrant and athletic die in their 20's and 30's, and I've seen Christians who did excessive sins including eating very unhealthy throughout their lives and lived in till their 70's and 80's. So that's why I don't believe your choices determine the length of your years but it certainly can determine the quality of your years. If I'm wrong with this view point, please let me know where I am on this topic, because I do believe I am open minded to other viewpoints.
Grant Abbott
Supporter
Wonderful perspectives from our ebible community. I have learned something from all of you. Let's consider the three important words in this question. Appointed means decided beforehand, designated, scheduled, prearranged, fixed, chosen, preordained, decreed, etc. Time refers to a point in time measured in hours and minutes or a plan, schedule, or arrangement when something should happen or be done. Die or death refers to the action of fact of dying or being killed, the state of being dead, the permanent ending of vital processes in a cell or tissue. The bible clearly teaches that God is sovereign over all his creation. The bible also clearly teaches that God has given humankind free will - to accept God's offer of salvation which results in eternal life in the presence of God, or, to reject God's offer and remain under condemnation resulting in eternal death. These two truths appear to conflict with each other but are really like the dual tracks of a railroad. Over time, as the train (a human being) moves toward its destination (human death), both God's sovereignty and humankind's free will are operating to move us down the track (our pathway of life). We easily understand our freewill because of the choices we make every day. Some days we choose to indulge the desires of our flesh and fall into sin, rebelling against God's will for our lives. Other days we do a better job of surrendering to the Lordship of Jesus Christ and we actually accomplish what God has planned for our lives. But God's sovereignty is much more difficult because God exists outside of time. Let's look at this issue like a puzzle. For us, inside of time, we see some of the pieces in place for our past life experiences but there are a lot of blanks for the future. When God looks at the puzzle he sees all the pieces in place, our complete life story, from beginning to end. Because he exists outside of time, he knows the future. He sees each puzzle piece before it is placed in the story of our lives, before it actually happens. So, when an event happens, is it because God willed it to be so, or is it the result of our freewill choices. God has a plan and purpose for each human being (Jeremiah 29:11). God has a list of good works that he wants us to accomplish in our human life (Ephesians 2:10). God even works in us to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose (Philippians 2:13). God began a good work in us and will carry it on to completion until the day that Jesus comes again (Philippians 1:6). So, do we have any choice in the matter. In my view, we have all the choice in the world. I believe that the list of good works that God has given each of us to complete is a very long list that will require a lot of time. It is up to each one of us how committed we are to accomplishing God's will - in, for and through - our lives. If we take a fatalist perspective that it doesn't matter what we do with our lives - because God will just have his way anyway - then we will fall into a lot of sin, leading to a life of evil and wickedness. For every non-Christian, that kind of life traps people in the devil's schemes - to steal, kill and destroy - to an early end of human life. But for the Christian whose life is dedicated to pleasing God, that human life will usually last for a long time. God wants to use his holy and righteous servants to build his kingdom on earth and to display, for the world to see, what God is doing in the life of each Christian for his honour and glory. Why do babies die? Why do devout Christians die tragically and early in life? Why did Jesus die when he was only 33 years old? Because God is sovereign, he already knows what the puzzle pieces are. We don't get to see the complete picture until we stand before Jesus and every event of our human lives is revealed for us to see. Personally, I want to complete as much of God's "to-do" list as I possibly can, before I go home (die) or Jesus comes.
Frederick Thomas
Supporter
Trying to fit the dots. Many die young for many right and wrong reasons. Many live long for many right and wrong reasons. But a long life is a choice and is promised: Eph. 6:2: HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER (which is the first commandment with a promise): Eph 6:3 SO THAT IT MAY BE WELL WITH YOU, AND THAT YOU MAY LIVE LONG ON THE EARTH. (NASB) And yes God has foreknowledge of our choices, and God, by letting us into His world, also determined our choices to be played out. Conclusion: You cannot flip the coin in God’s world if you are not in it. And, you cannot of your own get into God’s world unless He chose you to be in His world (Is. 66:9). God’s successful purposes override our “flipping of the coin” intentions. Meaning the flipping of the coin will work as for the reason God allowed it. So what we intended as our choices, God determined to serve for His ultimate will. (Pro. 16:33) We may throw the dice, but the LORD determines how they fall. Like saying the lord has determined for which reason the dice fall. Our choices will come to pass and the lord determined it for His winning.
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